The Fifth Estate are Garage Rock pioneers whose influence stretches across six decades of Rock history. With the recent release “Then and Now” — and the second official video for the album’s standout track “Junkies To The News” premiering September 10 via Deko Entertainment — the band once again demonstrates an uncanny ability to marry raw, classic grit with contemporary urgency. The song’s critique of media obsession and cultural overload arrives wrapped in the group’s trademark swagger; the record also features contributions from Grammy-winning guitarist Paul Nelson and has already been praised as “one of the most timeless Rock and Roll records out these days.”
This interview is aimed at unpacking the creative choices behind “Then and Now,” the making of the “Junkies To The News” video, and how a band that helped shape modern Rock continues to evolve while remaining fiercely true to its roots. Thank you for taking the time to speak with Progressive Rock Journal.
You’ve been playing together in various forms for sixty years — that’s a vast span. Looking back, which single moment or decision do you feel most clearly set the band on the path that made you who you are today?
Thanks for talking with us. This is Ken Evans and Rick Engler of the band here. Rick is one of the lead singers and the lead vocal in Junkies. I am the drummer. We had already made it to National recognition once. The same band playing as The D-men early on. But then feeling some urgency to move things along faster, Rick went to the NYC Brill building office to office knocking on doors and finding Real Good productions Steve and Bill Jerome. We signed a contract in December 1966, recorded in Jan 67 and broke on Billboard in April 67. Ah, the good old days. But it had taken 3 years of playing and playing sometimes 6 hours a night in Greenwich Village and already having made it to national prominence to do that. After doing a national Saturday night Hullabaloo TV show where Brian Epstein was one of the hosts, we were talking with them about working together. But after the Summer of 66 after John Lennon’s unfortunate Jesus remarks they had their hands full and we started not hearing back from them. We had to get going.
“Then and Now” is a title that implies continuity and change. What did you want the record to say about The Fifth Estate’s identity, and how did you balance honoring the past with exploring new territory?
Early on a dance rock band and still a rock band at the core, but now able and inclined to push the boundaries with songs reflecting state of the world today.
“Junkies To The News” is a blunt, timely commentary on media consumption. Can you walk us through the genesis of the song — where the lyric idea started, and how the music was shaped to deliver that message?
With Junkies the lyric idea started when we and Rick realized people were getting depressed with media bombardment, wanting to drop out, yet wanting to do something – “make the world better” – “reach out to the world”. Music was shaped to be low key in the initial verses with acoustic guitar and synthesizers without drums, with the focus on the words. Then bringing it up to a higher intensity with drums and fuzz distorted guitar in the choruses becoming rather anthemic.
The press notes draw a parallel between the anthemic quality of “Junkies To The News” and Oasis-style hooks, even suggesting influence the other way around. How do you feel about younger bands or later movements citing (or being compared to) your work — is influence a flattering thing, a complicated thing, or both?
A. We love Oasis styling after us right down to Rick’s cherry red Gibson ES-355 and Bill’s Epiphone. Very flattering. But we’d just like them to give us the credit for it we deserve. Check out our 1968 video of us doing Tomorrow Is My Turn ( The Fifth Estate – Tomorrow Is My Turn (Official Video) and see and hear the resemblance. A bigger more punky/garagy sound than The Beatles at that time. This video was done in 1968. Exactly what Oasis started doing again 25 years later in the 1990s.
You worked with Grammy-winning guitarist Paul Nelson on this album. How did that collaboration come about, and what specific contributions or moments in the studio bear his imprint?
I met him at The Music Room in Dennis, MA and he knew of our band. Turned out that we had gone to the same high school a few years apart in Stamford, CT just outside of New York. Man what was the chance of that in this music world? He’d been with and played with everybody from Johnny Winter to Clapton. I told him we were working on a new album and asked him if he knew of a good lead electric guitar player 😊 as Bill Shute our lead guy all these years was only doing acoustic at the moment. Paul asked to let him hear some of it. I did and he liked where it was and what was already going on. So Paul went to our studio which Doug Ferrara, our bass player, has and recorded the lead guitar parts on top of the tracks which were already done. He was just getting started helping us put things together when he went off on the road and without warning just passed away while driving. The studio moments with Paul .. junkies solo, the way Paul records – just sits and plays great solos one after another and different each time. We will miss him immensely – immensely. Rick’s brother who is a great guitar player himself now plays Paul’s parts. So we are now keeping it in the family and set to play live again. We haven’t done much except record since covid. But we had just done a very good album called Time Tunnel before that, produced by Shel Talmy of Who and Kinks fame and myself of 5E fame.
The new video promises a cinematic, visually arresting experience. From a band perspective, what was the brief you gave the director, and how do you feel the video amplifies — or reframes — the song’s ideas?
On the Junkies video Rick briefed the director to include footage of urban NYC and all the clubs we started out in and merg it with a live show appearance of the band. And to use a little humor and sadness to get the theme across and then end triumphantly. We played the Village Gate shown there with the original Byrds when they were huge and we were almost as big there in Greenwich Village for sure.
In sixty years you’ve seen listening habits shift from singles to LPs to streaming. Has that evolution changed the way you write songs — structurally, sonically, or conceptually — or do you still begin with the same core impulses you always have?
Outside of making the tunes a little longer sometimes (not limited by the AM 2 1/2 minute format anymore) – No, the same core impulses overall. But we are in different places and times of life now so that shows up automatically. Although we did have some fairly mature lyrics then and some almost juvenial ones now. Not sure if that is how we really are or if it is just to keep em guessing, and to keep ourselves guessing and going and creating. You never really want to think you have it all figured out. Would probably kill creativity and your love of doing all this.
Many of your peers from the formative era have either slowed down or moved into archives. What keeps The Fifth Estate actively creating and releasing new material today?
It’s what we love to do. And I believe some punks already said, “Too Dumb To Die.” But they did. So how smart is that??? But their music lives on. How cool is that !!!
There’s an authenticity in Garage Rock that often resists polish. In the studio for “Then and Now,” how did you decide which rough edges to keep and which to refine? Any debates about “too polished” vs “raw” during production?
Little debate. Pretty much straight out. We are a garage band and not so studied with music. We pretty much play what we play and it isn’t too hard to figure out where the final sound will be. Like we sound live. Not much thinking or trying to be something else. Just like on day 1 of it all with just 2 tracks – what you play is what you get, as much as possible. Although every once in a while we do get lucky creatively.
Touring has changed dramatically over the decades. How do you approach the live show now — setlist construction, audience engagement, and the role of new songs in a catalogue-heavy performance?
Audiences are so different. We consider all of what you said – sometimes. And depending on the audience, sometimes we don’t. But we have been playing together so long that we just wing it at times playing tunes we haven’t planned on to get the audience with us. Often it works and once in while it doesn’t. It’s a disaster then. Keeps it interesting. And now we often throw in songs from artists such as Oasis, U2, The Doors, Paul Butterfield Blues Band and a mix of our best catalogue and new album tunes. Junkies is very much in demand, especially with all that is happening in the world now.
The album is available on CD and Vinyl as well as streaming. For a band whose history is tied to physical formats, what does releasing on Vinyl mean to you in 2025?
Vinyl is vinyl man! It is the real needle deal. Does you good. Cool… Black Plastic !!! The rest of the formats caused a descending spiral for most of the music business so far.
Glad to see vinyl doing well again these days.
Lyrically “Then and Now” often grapples with contemporary culture. Are there recurring themes across the record you’d like listeners to pick up on beyond the immediate headlines?
No. Recurring Themes?? Hum… I’ll have to listen.
As veterans, what advice would you give to young bands trying to build a career in Rock today — specifically in terms of longevity, artistic integrity, and navigating the modern music industry?
Advice – write what you feel and dream. And just do, do, do, and don’t plan on too much. Often you’ll just frustrate yourself if it doesn’t happen. Often great things will happen you didn’t plan on. BE READY. Sound like The Fifth Estate band the best you can. 😊 What can I say. So many things change. Be yourselves.
Can you share a particular studio anecdote or rehearsal moment from the making of Then and Now that still makes you laugh, wince, or feel proud?
As a drummer I can recall a really great take of Media Star getting right near the end as we were playing it and the top of the headphones went down over my eyes. Our main rule for the band is never STOP. So I kept going with almost renewed vigor near and to the end. The other guys started laughing their balls off and were barely able to finish. And it is one of our better endings. Just an aside here, but I started that song, Media Star, exactly with the same intro I did on our So Little Time tune, nearly 60 years ago. So some things change and some things don’t. But still work.
Legacy is a word that can feel both heavy and hazy. How do you want The Fifth Estate to be remembered — by fans, by younger musicians, and by the history books.
Remember The Fifth Estate as the original garage rock band pioneers and still pioneering with new ideas. Or is it just old ideas but really good ones all over again? Not sure. I don’t remember. But they seem new I think.
Looking forward: what are the next steps after the video premiere? Are there plans for more videos, special editions of the album, festival appearances, or a tour that fans should know about?
We just take it a step at a time these days. All of the above as they come together and happen. Plus two more albums of recordings we have done over the years of totally new material and alternate versions are soon to be released. Playin as much as possible. Much more to come.
Finally — and perhaps personally — after sixty years of performing and recording, what still gives you the same thrill as those earliest shows? What keeps you excited to pick up your instruments tomorrow?
Well I probably won’t “pick up” my instrument tomorrow because I play drums. 😊 But playing the songs we gave birth to and watching the audience get excited and enthusiastic, it’s what it is all about. Oh and making $$$ once in a while. But mainly having a cool time is also what counts. Come see us play if you get a chance. You never know – you might not get another chance.
Thank you for speaking with Progressive Rock Journal. We appreciate the time and insight you’ve shared — from the creative intent behind Then and Now, to the making of “Then and Now,” and your reflections on a life spent advancing Rock.
And we did advance Rock. Early on no one even knew what that was or what to do or play. What we did really worked and still does. More than most people know or remember these days. Cool for asking us! Thanks! We mean it!!
Order your copy on CD or Vinyl: https://www.dekoentertainment.com/inthesquare/the-fifth-estate